Multiple Catalogs...seems like its going to get confusing.

[sabfoto]

I have been putting a lot of thought into how I want to arrange everything and I thought I had decided.  I will follow the bucket system since it seems efficient for backing up and restoring in the case of a disaster.  I also decided to follow the naming structure for its simplicity and to allow the dam software to serve its purpose rather than a file name. 

But here is my hangup:

I decided to start off with one catalog for my capture files, and one for my derivitives.  The problem is this:

I feel like I'm doing the work of categorizing everything into the catalog sets twice.  Which in some instances I literally am.  I like to play with files a lot.  I loved the darkroom and I love working digital files as well.  So I am tending to have a lot of derivative files. 

Recently I decided to start to build a book/webbook of my environmental and lifestyle portraiture to begin marketing myself for that work.  It immediately became a nightmare to try to gather images.  I had raw files and derivatives of some images.  I figured that I would look in the derivatives first, since if I spent the time to work on them, they're the better images.  But then when I got to the capture catalog, how do I separate out the ones I've already selected in the derivatives catalog?  I ended up with redundant searches and gathering.

My main concern is trying to do this several years from now and having multiple capture and multiple derivative catalogs.  After I search and build these catalog sets of my "best lifestyles" and it is spread over several catalogs, can I add that completed search to the current catalog so I don't have to do it again?

I think I'm missing a key method in searching and building catalog sets over multiple catalogs. 

Thanks in advance!

-Sheldon Sabbatini

[danaltick]

Sheldon,

With a good catalog manager, you can search across multiple catalogs and easily transfer images between catalogs.  Your catalogs can also hold over 100,000 images.  I would take Peter's advice and keep your catalog count to a minimum for better manageability.  I actually find it easier to put both my Raws and Derivatives in the same catalog, that way one search finds them all in the same catalog.  I would also not worry too much about too many catalogs in the future.  Technology will take care of that I'm sure.

Dan

[peterkrogh]

Sheldon,
I'm in general agreement with Dan.  A few more thoughts:

If everything can fit into one catalog, then do it that way.  I simply can't, due to the number of images I have. 

As I keep finding myself saying, sorting out the older disorganized work will be the hardest part of the deal.  You will just have to slog through it.  Going forward, if you will mark every original image when you turn it into a Master File, life will be much easier.
Peter

[sabfoto]

Thanks for the responses Dan and Peter.

It makes sense to "mark" a raw file that has been worked on and made into a master file.  That way you can simply do a search and remove images that would have been gathered as a derivative.

As far as having everything in one catalog, it seems counterintuative to me to have my raw files and my derivatives co-mingled.  I've tried it both ways, and having them separate seems to work better for me. 

Dan, what is a "good catalog manager"?  I've read that you can search multiple catalogs at once, but haven't done that.

Thanks again.

-Sheldon Sabbatini

[danaltick]

Sheldon,

Peter and I both use iView Media Pro 3.  It lends itself well to Peter's DAM implementation.  It's also discussed at length in the book.  There are other good catalog managers out there though.  I would recommend searching the forums here for info them.

As far as keeping your derivatives and originals in the same catalog, that's not a problem with the proper use of catalog sets/virtual sets....make use of them, they truly are invaluable.

Dan

[peterkrogh]

Sheldon,
How many total images do you currently have?  What is the split between originals and derivative?
Peter

[Rick McCleary]

If everything can fit into one catalog, then do it that way.  I simply can't, due to the number of images I have.

Peter, I've decided to catalog RAW's and DRV's together.  It just makes more sense to me.  If I find that the catalog is getting too big, I'll just start another one at that point in time.  Could be that there will be catalogs that span a full year, others may span a shorter period.  If I'm going to have multiple catalogs anyway, why not divide by time period rather than file type?  Does this make sense, or should I rethink my approach?  Also, I think it's been mentioned here before, but is it easy to search across multiple catalogs in iView?

As I keep finding myself saying, sorting out the older disorganized work will be the hardest part of the deal.  You will just have to slog through it.

Boy, you can say that again!  For my legacy DRV files, I'm putting those in a separate catalog.  (These are images that go back to when I first started to work digitally - summer of '94.)  Again, this is based on the concept of having multiple catalogs divided chronologically, not by file type.  Still make sense?

Going forward, if you will mark every original image when you turn it into a Master File, life will be much easier.
Peter

Can you clarify this?  When you say "mark" are you meaning to add a "master" keyword to the raw file?

Thanks - Rick

[sabfoto]

Sheldon,
How many total images do you currently have?  What is the split between originals and derivative?
Peter

20,000 Original and 5,000 Derivative or somewhere's in there.

I understand that you can fit a lot in a catalog, I'm just trying to weight the options.  I'm young in my career and have had the great opportunity to work with a wildlife photographer who is the most unorganized person in the world.  200,000 transpanrencies and he can't find a thing.  I don't want that to happen to me with digital files and I'm just trying to look towards the future.


Dan, I also have Iview Media Pro 3 (thats why I posted it in this forum topic) and I've read the book cover to cover once, and re-read specific chapters.  I also attending Peter's DAM talk in Salt Lake City.  I don't recall anywhere that it gave any instruction on searching multiple catalogs.  I'll look again.  I fully understand how to use virtual catalog sets, just not how to search my capture and derivative files and not have redundency (whether in a single catalog or multiple).

Thanks again...its working itself out in my head.

-Sheldon Sabbatini

[peterkrogh]

Sheldon,
Put everything in one catalog now (build thumbnails at 640 pixels, medium quality).  You can always split the catalog later - very quickly.  It really will be a lot easier to sort out the old stuff if you do this.
Peter

[danaltick]

Sheldon,

I don't believe Peter does discuss searching multiple catalogs in the book.  You can do that using the Find command though.

Don't forget, you can also search by file type listed in the Organize panel.  Raw is a file type.

Dan

[johnbeardy]

Sheldon

Another recommendation for a single catalogue approach. It's the same data so you manage it with the same database and use metadata to start slicing and diving into originals vs derivatives, 2005 vs 2006 etc.

Secondly, while iView's Find feature lets you search across catalogue files, in practice you'll often want to find files using other ways, especially the green dots that let you narrow down selections, and these don't work across catalogues. As well as thinking about finding files, think too about catalogue output activitieis, like contact sheets or web galleries, which need all items to be in the same catalogue.

Lastly, use to the full iView's ability to embed metadata into the images. Used in conjunction with iView's auto updating of folders, this makes your derivatives jump into your catalogue files without any need for further metadata entry.

John

[sabfoto]

Sheldon,

I don't believe Peter does discuss searching multiple catalogs in the book.  You can do that using the Find command though.

Don't forget, you can also search by file type listed in the Organize panel.  Raw is a file type.

Dan

I see it now.  Sorry for the ignorance. 

Sheldon

...As well as thinking about finding files, think too about catalogue output activitieis, like contact sheets or web galleries, which need all items to be in the same catalogue...
John

I've also encountered this problem when sending out a stock submission.


I'll drop everything into one catalog and give it a whirl.

Thanks for all the responses.

-Sheldon Sabbatini