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Print Page - keywords and labels and bears, oh my!

The DAM Forum

Software Discussions => idImager => Topic started by: R. Neil Haugen on December 11, 2009, 02:27:14 AM



Title: keywords and labels and bears, oh my!
Post by: R. Neil Haugen on December 11, 2009, 02:27:14 AM
I've been a user of Adobe programs from PS4 thru CS4, and of course Bridge and now Lightroom 2.5-64bit for basic processing.

I am trying out IDimager as a DAM product and am somewhat bemused and confused with the keywords/catalog labels naming/calling/describing schema. I've also got bleary eyes from hours of reading through pdf manuals on-screen.

I just want something simple ... my keywords of my several thousand images to come into IDimager as-is, and to be able to continue to work them back and forth as need arises without mucking up anything. So how the heck do I set the Options panel?  I've studied it and read about it in the manual, re-read, re-read, checked other things in the manual, then re-read it again several times more, and I can't even figure out EXACTLY what is the difference 'twixt a keyword and a Catalog Label, let alone how to get forth-and-back work to ... work.

Help?

rNeil


Title: Re: keywords and labels and bears, oh my!
Post by: havezet on December 11, 2009, 05:53:56 AM
Hi rNeil,

It's not as difficult as it may appear.

http://wiki.idimager.com/index.php?title=Getting_Started

Quote
Catalog labels are not exactly the same as metadata keywords. IDI separated these two because metadata keywords are simple flat lists (no hierarchy), meaning you'd be quite limited in organizing keywords. Catalog labels are more flexible and the good part is that you can keep catalog labels and metadata keywords in sync. I highly recommend that you use catalog labels for keywording.

By assigning catalog labels to your images you are in fact adding keywords, but while a keywords is only a "string" without additional intelligence, catalog labels are more. For instance you can tell IDimager to keep a catalog label private and in that case the catalog is *not* written to the keywords while you have it available in your catalog. This way you will be able to search on it while at the same time you are guaranteed that this info is not sent out to your customers. Another feature in IDimager allows you to "map" a keyword to an image detail field. For instance you have a catalog label called "San Francisco" then you are able to map this catalog label to the City field on the Image Content tab of the Image Details (alt+enter). Another extra is that for each catalog label you can tell IDimager that when you assign a label that it should also assign all the parent catalog labels. For instance; you have a label hierarchy "Places -> USA -> California -> San Francisco". Then when you assign the label "San Francisco", IDimager will automatically assign "California" and "USA"... and if these parents are also mapped to fields these will also be filled on syncing the image. One more thing; you can also assign a GEO location to a catalog label. Then when yousync the image, IDimager will automatically GEO tag the image. For instance; you have a catalog label "Statue of Liberty". This is a "fixed place" and so youcould add a GEO location to it. Then as you assign the label your images is also GEO tagged.

Hert


Title: Re: keywords and labels and bears, oh my!
Post by: havezet on December 11, 2009, 05:56:08 AM
Btw; are you using V4 or V5beta? If you're using V5 then you may want to switch ON the option for auto-sync. Then as you assign catalog labels to yur images they will automatically be written out as metadata keywords.

Hert


Title: Re: keywords and labels and bears, oh my!
Post by: danaltick on December 11, 2009, 08:45:36 AM
rNeil,

IDI does not differentiate between keywords and catalog labels.  This concept took a while for me to get my head around as well.  There is actually a Keywords Catalog Label branch in IDI where all your IPTC keywords get imported from your images.  Once imported you can modifiy them and even create hierarchies within that branch just like any other catalog labels branch; however, I wouldn't recommend that.  Instead, I would create a separate Catalog Sets branch for my custom catalog sets or virtual sets, which are in fact just another grouping of what IDI calls catalog labels.  IDI actually has some pre-defined branches that you can use or delete if you wish, such as People, Events, Places, Objects, any yes, Keywords.  Again the Keywords branch will automatically get filled with your IPTC keywords on import.  I use these pre-defined branches in a similar fashion to Expression Media.  IDI has scripts that can fill these just like EM.  The thing to remember is that when syncing, IDI writes all its catalog labels, not just the Keywords, to the images' IPTC keywords field.  The hierarchies are preserved through the use of a user-defined delimiter and these hierarchies can be imported back into IDI and preserved.  IDI also writes these hierarchies out to an XMP schema very similar to Expression Media.  Hope that clears it up somewhat.

Dan


Title: Re: keywords and labels and bears, oh my!
Post by: R. Neil Haugen on December 11, 2009, 11:30:29 AM
Thanks for the comments, I DO love this place! I'm still trying to get my brain to understand EXACTLY what choices I should make. And the "jargon" explaining the choices reminds me of so much of the computer helps I've seen ... if I understood the terminology (the jargon) used to explain things, I wouldn't need the explanation in the first place! Hert, I don't mean to belittle your rather awesome work, just note that when those familiar with the guts of something talk to the Uninitiated, ESPECIALLY when they're having to also translate to another language, well, the Uninitiated may not quite understand things.

I've followed Dan's posts here for quite some time, been through them and re-read them. I've also enjoyed and found very profitable reading through Hert's comments. It's amazing to get the AUTHOR of the software helping here with it's use. Thank you to both of you! And of course, Peter and JBeardy too!

For Hert: I'm trying IDI4, and expect to get through all this and purchase the Pro. Should I just start with the V5Beta instead?


So,  IDI will bring in my keywords out of LR2/Bridge usage, and when I make "catalog labels", it's just the IDI flavor of what's commonly called keywords, and when I do additional work and/or create further derivatives in LR/Bridge/CS4 the "labels" will survive the round-trip just fine ...

Do I need to set anything in the "Options" panel (which is often called a "Preferences" panel) or do the defaults do this?

And ... the IDI language keeps referring to LR keywords as "flat", noting their "labels" can be hierarchical. Two things are quite odd to me about this comment ... first, I do have a few hierarchical keywords I've tried in LR, and they do work; JBeardy here has written extensively on using controlled vocabulary sets of hierarch's and many others use them. Second, even in the IDI manual, they note that when choosing delimiters, that LR ALWAYS uses a pipe " | ". Um, if LR always uses a pipe to delimit it's hierarchical keywords, isn't that acknowledging they HAVE hierarchical keywords? Just puzzles me.

Neil