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Print Page - IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP

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Software Discussions => ImageIngester and ImageVerifier => Topic started by: Louie Sherwin on December 28, 2007, 05:25:48 PM

Title: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: Louie Sherwin on December 28, 2007, 05:25:48 PM

I ran into a problem yesterday with some JPEG images that I imported from my Canon SD800 camera. At first I was going to post this in the iView forum but after reading the topic iView "Open With" command, ACR, and lost metadata? ( in the iView forum and the follow on one iView 'open with', ACR 'open', IIP and missing metadata? ( in this forum I decided to put my post in the II forum as it seem to be related.

Since the images were all JPEG I checked the "Verify JPEGs" and "Merge XMPs" options. I also applied several keywords and other metadata using then new metadata method. The import finished without a problem and  launched Bridge. In Bridge I started my initial ratings. Next I opened iView and imported the images into my working library. At this point everything looked good all  my ratings and metadata were visible in both applications.

Next I started refining ratings on iView. After I was done selected all the images and did a sync annotations and exported to original files. There are now two problems
  • None of the changes made in iView are visible in Bridge
  • When I make changes in Bridge they are not now seen by iView (via sync annnotatons, import) 

In fact in the case of Ratings, after I synced back to the files in iView all of the ratings in disappeared in Bridge. Further investigation using exiftool shows that the rating change made in iView with a subsequent sync is making it into the file. However, these changes are not now visible in Bridge.

I went back to some JPEG images imported before the "Merge XMPs" option was available and I can change ratings in iView, sync them and the are immediately visible in Bridge. This leads me to believe that there is some problem in my newly imported JPEGs.


Title: Re: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: peterkrogh on December 28, 2007, 09:20:38 PM
Thanks for tracking this down, and posting in an easy to follow manner.

Hopefully Marc can figure out what's going on and shed some light here.


Title: Re: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: Louie Sherwin on December 30, 2007, 12:10:15 PM
Hi Marc,

Here is some additional information that I gleaned out of the JPEG files using exiftool. Essentially I am seeing a bunch of the XMP data has been duplicated. All of the fields that are duplicated were either created as part of the import or were subsequently written out by iView when I exported annotations. It seems as though iView is somehow writing out a different set of tags than it is reading. Once this duplicity is in a file then the data handoff between applications fails because they are now reading  and writing to different fields.

I just confirmed this idea by changing the rating in Bridge from 2 to 3 and running exiftool to examine the results. There are now two rating fields one with a "2" and one with a "3".

Here is the exiftool command  and output after changing the rating in Bridge. I am not sure why the "-D" switch didn't seem to work in the example.

exiftool -G1 sherwin_20071223_2267_CO.JPG -a -e -s -D -xmp-iptccore:all -xmp-xmp:all | sort
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CountryCode                     :
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CountryCode                     :
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrCity     : Encinitas
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrCity     : Encinitas
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrCtry     : USA
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrCtry     : USA
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrRegion   : CA
[XMP-iptcCore]      - CreatorContactInfoCiAdrRegion   : CA
[XMP-iptcCore]      - IntellectualGenre               :
[XMP-iptcCore]      - IntellectualGenre               :
[XMP-iptcCore]      - Location                        : Big Bear Lake
[XMP-iptcCore]      - Location                        : Big Bear Lake
[XMP-iptcCore]      - Scene                           : ,
[XMP-iptcCore]      - SubjectCode                     : ,
[XMP-xmp]           - MetadataDate                    : 2007:12:30 10:53:55-08:00
[XMP-xmp]           - ModifyDate                      : 2007:12:23 18:05:40-08:00
[XMP-xmp]           - Rating                          : 2
[XMP-xmp]           - Rating                          : 3


Title: Re: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: Louie Sherwin on December 31, 2007, 07:07:52 PM

After extensive testing I believe that this may be a bug with the "Merge XMP" option for JPEG images. It seems to confuse iView 3.1 when iView tries to update the metadata through a "Sync Annotatons..., Export annotations to original file".  However, since Bridge works fine with the same image files it could be really also be a bug in iView. In any case the net effect is that if you use this option in IIP using iView to make further metadata updates will mess up your image files. I have not tried this with EM so I don't know if it happens there as well.

If I import JPEG images with the "Merge XMP" turned on, then import that image into an iView catalog,  then make additional changes and then export those changes back to the original file, much of the XMP data ends up being duplicated in the image. From this point on Bridge will use one set of XMP metadata and iView will use the other making it impossible to sync annotations.

Using exiftool -v on the image files I can see that after I export from iView there are now two JPEG APP1, XMP directory sections and I can see that Bridge is updating one and iView will update the other.

JPEG APP1 (4933 bytes):
  + [XMP directory, 4904 bytes]
JPEG APP1 (3964 bytes):
  + [XMP directory, 3935 bytes]

For the sake of completeness I tried just about every possible permutation metadata updates between IIP, Bridge and iView and did not find any other instance where they failed to update correctly. I also acknowledge that you did warn us that this was a new and relatively untested feature and to be careful when using it.

Marc, please let me know if would like to look at any of my images that are exhibiting this problem.

For others on the forum if you think that you might have this problem and you have exiftool you can quickly tell by running the following command from the MacOS Terminal window. These additional -xmpxxx filter the output so that you will only see the areas of metadata that are affected by this problem. Otherwise exiftool will dump the all the image metadata and will make it hard to see the dupliates.

exiftool YourImage.JPG -xmp-iptccore:all -xmp-xmprights:all -xmp-dc:all -a | sort

I am now going to try to figure out how to best repair this as my backup copies are also affected. Phil, the author of exiftool has give me a suggestion for how to remove the duplicates.  As soon as I get it figured out I will post my solution back on this topic.


Title: Re: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: Dawnne Gee on January 01, 2008, 02:00:25 PM
Louie, this is completely off-topic, but i must say i seriously miss shooting around Big Bear Lake, and i wholly and completely envy you. it's 3 (freakin) degrees outside right now and the wind's blowing about 25mph.

Title: Re: IPTC metadata particularly "Rating" confused after IIP
Post by: Marc Rochkind on January 02, 2008, 09:14:06 AM

I am catching up to this thread after taking a few days off. Thanks for all of your investigative work.

As far as I know, there isn't a standard defined for how to put bulk metadata into JPEGs that is also followed by all the relevant applications. The best I can am able to do at this point is (1) state what IIP does, and (2) make the addition of metadata to JPEGs optional.

Here's what IIP does, although it sounds like you've mostly already figured this out:

1. If the JPEG already has an APP1 block that contains XMP metadata, it is discarded. (No attempt is made to merge anything.)

2. A new APP1 block containing the XMP data from the sidecar is added.

3. Nothing else in the JPEG is modified.

Now, this could definitely cause problems if any other app (e.g., iView/EM) doesn't expect XMP data to be in an APP1 block, or expects that block to be in a particular place, or expects it in a position relative to something else in the file.

I did verify that what I'm doing works with the downstream Adobe apps.

That's where I am as of now. I will put on my list of things to do to come up with a scheme, if possible, that works with both iView/EM and Adobe. Don't know when I will get to it. I also need to emphasize that I don't know if a solution is possible... the fault may lie in iView/EM.

I think your analysis of what's wrong is quite accurate, if that's any consolation.